I'd be happy to take nude pictures of myself for you to post on a website. Not sure how much revenue that would create though. Will you be looking to generate revenue with some sort of product or service or just advertising revenue?

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[Link to www.3dprevis.com]

Just ad revenue. You make a site that gets lots of traffic and then you make money from the ads.

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yeah, I can never think of anything particularly clever. Maybe some sort of downloadable textures site, pay a small fee to download as many textures as you like. Theres quite a bit of work to do creating textures for that though.

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How about a free one? already got one in the works We have over 1g of textures already.

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Please support us and post a [Link to www.digitalartsfront.com] on your website.

Yep that sounds good. For a while there was one called Mayang.com which had great hi res textures but it was pulled down. I went there almost daily, all it takes is going out with a camera and getting clean hires photos. I can upload quite a few from my personal stash when you are ready.
It would be even more attractive if there were max scenes, models, even sound bites aswell. no idea on the logistics of serving all that data though.

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Yea we plan on making other resources avalibale but from other sites. It is kinda hard to give people everything in one spot. We will make a network of resource sites. If you can cntribute that would be great man.

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Please support us and post a [Link to www.digitalartsfront.com] on your website.

There are a lot of free texture sites out there but not many that have bump and specular maps as well. Perhaps you could invest in a copy of crazy bump or something like that and you could churn out a bunch of textures complete with bump, normal and specular. That'd attract people to the site. The only problem would be the startup cost and there'd still be a bit of ongoing work to do. Also, we've all got cameras so I'm sure we could accumulate a pretty extensive reference library.

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[Link to www.3dprevis.com]

This may be possible. Thanks for the idea.

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Most business models are created due to a restructuring of an economic system. The xerox machine, internet, air plane, and even cardboard boxes are good examples of what causes this change. Jobs are lost and replaced with some unforeseen business model. These changes force restructuring. As far as destroying goes... what can you do for free that others are charging for?

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Yea we are working this idea into 3.5 thanks man.

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I think I didn't communicate very well in my last post..... let me retry.

What if memberships could be paid for in other ways aside from forms of currency?
Lets say DAF decides to go into selling 3d models. DAF staff could make a list of models with specifications that would end up being the property of DAF. Users could elect to work free of charge to give 100% profits to DAF. DAF would open multiple accounts on 'model vending' sites, such as 'Turbo Squid', and sell. This could go for textures, animations, audio clips or anything that has a demand in the market, DAF enters into.
Users that participate (and do well) will get special ranking icons for their avatar (badges, stars, etc.).

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Yea people wont do it man. People are lazy making them work for things as a biz model is a bad idea.

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Please support us and post a [Link to www.digitalartsfront.com] on your website.

Some one said that before wikipedia was made. I say it's worth the risk and it wont cost you anything but time that should pay back.

edit:
Again. You'll be trading needed models (stuff that's in demand) with special icons and memberships that you're not selling a lot of anyway. A bad business model is one where you take out a loan and make no money.

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But what does the general user get out of it? Making a model is a lot of work to do for a forum membership.

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[Link to www.3dprevis.com]

You're pushing $4 dollars a month for a membership. That adds up. Anyone who submits a model would be saying the value is much higher. Value is perspective. You produce the memberships so they aren't worth much to you. You'll hand one out to your cousin if you felt like it.

What you do have are either 3dmodlers who are unemployed or who can't legaly use their software to make models. Oh crap! We can't get mixed up with legality issues! We'll get in trouble! Or will we?

Students send work using school software to places that use their models to gain revenue like competitions, seminars, animation studios, etc. Sending work to DAF would be no different. Why is this legal? Because the user end agreement puts the user at fault if something goes wrong.

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Dude how long does it take to write a wiki article. Few hours right. How long does it take to make a kick ass model ... anywhere from days to weeks. Also people are very protective of there art and not that keen to share it. I mean not to say that if people here expresed an interest in doing this I wouldn't consider it.

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You're right. NO wait. Unless you're writing it on WIKIPEDIA, where it needs to be approved or the public removes it. No. A paragraph can take years of pushing before it's put on. IF you don't like the idea based on the fact you don't want to give awards for effort, I get that. But you can't convince me it wouldn't work. I could go vastly deeper in to why it would work, but that doesn't matter right?

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I dont see why you are taking offence man. It is simple why would someone share there hardwork with others. We do not live in a socalist society, people have not been rasied with that ideal. Most people would chose 5 dollars vs hours of labour.

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Please support us and post a [Link to www.digitalartsfront.com] on your website.

I'm pushing the idea not for you, but for everyone on the site. Sorry if I leaned on you in the process.

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We are considering syndicated news for 3.5

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Please support us and post a [Link to www.digitalartsfront.com] on your website.

Yeah, I think people can sell their models and get all the profit (if any) through turbosquid. but you think about it and then you think, but is this model good enough to sell?. and then if it is you think, but do I really want everyone to have access to my wonderfull creation?.
And then you don't bother. Yep people are lazy.
I think a place where we could all upload textures and materials and models for free sharing use could attract people. I know i use several sites like that but there arent that many good ones out there.

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I'm in complete agreement.

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Please support us and post a [Link to www.digitalartsfront.com] on your website.

Here's the difference. DAF staff will be less lazy than the users by selling the models in more places than turbo squid. They're so much less lazy than us USERS they even built this site!
Laziness works to DAF's advantage because we already have accounts here.

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So you're saying that DAF should be like a broker for people wanting to sell models?

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[Link to www.3dprevis.com]

That's another idea that's similar. But I was wanting to work out a way for DAF to get away with full profit and not have to work as hard.
Splitting profits would get you into a whole new ball game in the business world. It could even turn into the main revenue source if there's a demand (don't doubt power of lazy).
Just to be clear: that's not what I was saying.

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Forget my last idea. That's turning into an uphill battle, I'm fighting alone.

So many art forums have a nitch in the market.
A few examples:
Cgsociety and Cgtalk are the same organization. They do GOOD news for free. Result? Lots of hard core users.
3dtotal has gobs of tutorials and news.
We're closer to foundation3d.com but they to are heavily invested into news and resources.

Lets find our own nitch. That way we can say we're a forum first but a ___ second.

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Yeh, it's that little blank that's the problem.

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[Link to www.3dprevis.com]

+User rending. "you make it we render it." Could the site do that?
+Portfolio maker, for jobs, that exports to pdf and looks nice! Add a service where it's printed and mailed. Sounds big and complex? Wrong! There are companies that do this already that could just become DAF's printer.
+wikidigitalartsfront: The tutorial section was already a step in that direction.
+ uhh...

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Cool ideas. The rendering one would require a fairly large setup cost I would imagine. The portfolio maker might be more promising. Did I hear Matt say somewhere that his dad was in the printing game? Or am I imagining things?

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[Link to www.3dprevis.com]

You heard right. Thats how we can offer the whole prints thing for premium members.

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Please support us and post a [Link to www.digitalartsfront.com] on your website.

--Matt

the portfolio idea is a good one, but you might lose out on some customers who consider their portfolios entirely their own, and this includes even the transitions between renders, and the presentation+music etc... still a good idea though
another thing you could do is create a library of game assets....things that could easily be imported into games.....this could include low/high-poly models of vehicles, environments, weapons, objects and even custom characters.
this could be tied up with the aforementioned textures idea, and you'll have a ready database for game creators. this database can be constantly updated with newer models, and also custom 2d artwork for games.
the incentive for the users? probably a copy of the game in which their model was used, or (shudder) a percentage of the profit.
it wouldn't involve that much effort since a majority of the models would be low-poly, and so easier to model.

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Cogito, Ergo Sum

Going back to the portfolio maker, there should be an option to make it private. In fact the application should just produce a web document only visible to the user. Hot linking the portfolio is where DAF would have to charge in order to keep up with bandwidth.

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Believe it or not bandwidth is not really an issue yet. And wont be for quite some time I expect (hooray for 500GB traffic).

This month we are on track to hit 550,000 hits which will take is to 7.5 GB of data.

We currently have 2.4 GB of images, and our database has just hit 1 GB.

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Please support us and post a [Link to www.digitalartsfront.com] on your website.

--Matt

I'm not logging on and off enough, then.... ;p

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So any of these ideas appealing to Jamie or Matt?

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[Link to www.3dprevis.com]

We're planning on taking the Free Resources idea to new levels of awesome.

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Please support us and post a [Link to www.digitalartsfront.com] on your website.

--Matt

Are we ready for such awesomeness?

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I've only just gotten over the awesomeness of V3. I'm not sure I could handle more at this stage.

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[Link to www.3dprevis.com]

Yea there have been some good suggestions. It is just a matter of time. Honeslty we have made no money from DAF and it is starting to feel like flogging a dead horse. Im trying to get the motivation back to put myself through the pain of finishing 3.5. With the new site done and some good advertising we should be able to start pulling in some ad dollars. The reason we want the money is so we can justify the long hours of work that needs to go into it to keep it fresh.
'
So while some of these ideas are good, it wont be happening anytime soon.

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Please support us and post a [Link to www.digitalartsfront.com] on your website.

So far it looks like you've been looking at what works on other sites and what other sites don't have. You'd think that would be enough.
There are lots of big forums out there that don't spend tons of money on advertising.

Quick question. Does traffic increase when a new challenge is posted? Do more people sign up after those dates?

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Challenges are good for increasing overall traffic on the site from current members as it stirs up fuss and everyone gets discussing them. But they take organizing too. Maybe if we had someone who was willing to come up with fresh challenge ideas and promote and manage them??? *wink wink*

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Please support us and post a [Link to www.digitalartsfront.com] on your website.

--Matt

Most of the time I'll be browsing around online and find some cool artwork someone's hotlinked or is posted on google images. That's how I first found elfwood.com and cgsociety. Maybe that's the key to artfrorum success. Your thoughts?
And I'm always up for helping out.

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As for challenges... whats won in these said challenges? It's entirely possible for DAF to contact some local retailers and ask for their support and even ask for them to have links up on their sites so long as maybe DAF have a page of sponsors and chuck small logos up on some advertizing and any e-mails sent out on DAF's behalf. This way users can win tangable prizes wich could draw in the crouds wich brings more ad traffic.

Im willing to give a hand with the challegnges... I mean im no 3d kid but I can come up with fresh ideas and help promote them. I have no life... make the most of my boredom.

There are also opportunitys to get people involved in the site via facebook ect ect. push that further maybe? Myspazz? just randomly adding people with"Artist" under their whatsamahoose.

Also... how many diferent conventions devoted to digital art are there? Isnt Armageddon and all that shizz meant to be for digital arts? As a website like this you guys should be able to get media access if you wanted to add more to the news side of things. If you wanted to get a site thats a bit more news driven, I dunno. Im not up on the australian conventions.

A fun thing to draw people in could even be interviews with leading artists talking about their practices, their work, how they got where they are ect ect. Its actually really simple to get artists you like to feature on the site - e-mail is a powerful tool. Theres already a news section for it. this could be a really nice up close and personal with true industry people and could be fantastic for drawing people in when they google their favourite artist. Hell id be more than happy to start e-mailing. It simple, its as easy as sending out an e-mail. Were learning off great artists, and were pretty much making traffic off their fame and the cooler part would be for everyone to say who they want to hear from.

I may be off the beaten track here. Just some ideas to draw in the crouds.

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Gee Greenslade [Link to www.missgee.net]

damn i think none of that made sense.

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Gee Greenslade [Link to www.missgee.net]

Great ideas gee.

We had planned on maybe offering prizes like Gnomon DVD's, Ballistic books (even though they're our sworn enemy ). but again, its spending money when the site isnt making any, and its hard to choose a good area of the site to invest in.

We have a facebook group, maybe it needs some effort spent in finding other digital arts groups and poaching users from them

We had plans for syndicated news in v3.5 but not sure if thats still going ahead. It would be nice to have original news, but someone has to make the effort gathering and writing all of that.

Interviews would be a mad idea. I am all for it. Get cracking! We could even dedicate a section of the site towards this.

Also I have earlier mentioned a print-based project that I have in mind. It really came together for me last night while I was trying to get to sleep. Haven't even told jamie about this one yet. But it could be lots of fun!

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Please support us and post a [Link to www.digitalartsfront.com] on your website.

--Matt

Orright then!!! I'll get cracking on some fun interviews!


As for prizes... as i said, if we can manage to get in good with some local retailers, advertize them a bit on the site then maybe we could get some free stuff for people to win? I dunno, Its worth giving it a go if we can. Stuff like computer parts, cameras, phones even... whatever. I'm sure there would be people willing to help out.

Yeah news would be hard, so maybe its worth focusing more on artist interaction, getting some big names interviewed and such. Giving users the chance to ask questions bla bla bla. How does the chat part of this site work? Maybe we could try to organise artist chats? Find big names to come and chat online with users once a month or something. They often do it with big musicians, actors and even big brother fu*kheads.

I dunno... what do other people think?

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Gee Greenslade [Link to www.missgee.net]

Chat section of the site is kind of up in the air at the moment. Theres a few bugs in it it seems. But featured artist chat sounds like a good idea.

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Please support us and post a [Link to www.digitalartsfront.com] on your website.

--Matt

Oh and I have A3 posters and stickers in the pipeline. Just finalizing the designs. Then getting them printed next week hopefully.

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Please support us and post a [Link to www.digitalartsfront.com] on your website.

--Matt

radcore!

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Gee Greenslade [Link to www.missgee.net]

It's funny that you mention interview as I was actually thinking about doing them for the site the other day. I was thinking we could interview Matt about Figaro.

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[Link to www.3dprevis.com]

I had the same idea.

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Please support us and post a [Link to www.digitalartsfront.com] on your website.

--Matt

yeah yeah that would be perfect...

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Gee Greenslade [Link to www.missgee.net]